[ic] re: what is help response demonstrates the problem

[Jamie Neil]

> -----Original Message-----
> From: interchange-users-admin@icdevgroup.org
> [mailto:interchange-users-admin@icdevgroup.org]On Behalf Of rick
> kershner
> Sent: 19 May 2003 17:50
> To: interchange-users@icdevgroup.org
> Subject: [ic] re: what is help response demonstrates the problem
>
>
> This is exactly what I was referring to. Bully for you that you
> find most of your answers in the archives. So effing what?

On an initial inspection of your recent rant, my troll alarm went off.
However on closer inspection I think you may actually be trying to make a
valid point and not just piss people off. So I'll take the bait and comment
on a few of your points.

> I do not give a good g - d  how you feel about "most people",
> etc. If you feel this way don't answer the questions; why waste
> everyone else's time.
>
> If these questions have been answered previously, the proper help
> thing to do is to give the questioner the URL to the answer as in:
> "The answer can be found here
> http://www.icdev.org/11111/22222/33333.htm" Nebulously saying "it
> is in the archives" is helping no-one; hence the repeating of the
> same question.
>
> The other help alternative is to go into the archive, cut and
> paste the answer into a response, and send it - off-list
> (privately) - to the questioner.

If we were all working on a commercial helpdesk, then I couldn't agree more.
But we're not. AFAIK none of the contributors to this list are paid to
provide IC support to it's readers, so any advice that is offered here is by
their own goodwill and from a desire to see the community develop.

If someone can't be bothered to search through the available resources
before firing off an email to the mailing list then any responses that they
get will likely be of the RTFM variety.

>
> If the question is about compiling the perl dist, give them a
> Perl URL to one of the Perl Help sites, or reread the question to
> see if it is unique to that version/configuration/etc. (why do
> you think people send that info?)
>
> I could not have demonstrated what is NOT help better.You have an
> attitude problem: this is not a "help" attitude. A "help"
> attitude (customer service attitude, et. al. ) is typified by a
> basic respect for the customer - this demonstrates none.

Customer services are provided by commercial organisations for money. This
is free software.

> I understand you are tired of seeing the "I have no clue..."
> messages. Frankly, you can either help them have a clue or Grow
> up, get a clue yourself and shut up. the (OK I'll say it)
> CHILDISH response "it's in the archives" has no place in a HELP
> group. If ytou don't actually want to help the person why respond
> in the first place? Is this an EGO issue?

Personally I prefer an "It's in the archives" response to being totally
ignored. It's not childish, it's the response of someone who has taken the
bother to answer you, but doesn't have the time (or the inclination) to do
all the legwork as well.

>
> The point here is that help questions deserve helpful answers. If
> you don't want to give a helpful answer why are YOU posting at
> all? examine YOUR motives in posting. Moderators should moderate
> out all the childish non-answer answer posts as that will remove
> the motivation for them.

Telling people that the answer is in the archives or another IC resource
_IS_ a helpful answer.

> Respect people asking questions, no one said that having DB Admin
> / sys admin experience was a requirement for using Interchange.
> Most people are using Interchange not because of a conscious
> choice but because their host provides it as it is free (or
> Agora, or OS Commerce, or....). There is no reason to be abusive,
> and the non-answer answers are basically abusive. the attitude
> that other people have no clue is abusive. the attitude that
> their questions do not belong here are abusive.
>
> How can I say it Better; Please go away if you are more a
> nuisance than a help?

Couldn't agree more... ;)

Personally, I have no major critisisms of the IC list itself. In fact it's
one of the more responsive lists that I have been involved with. However I
_do_ think that a lot of the basic questions which recieve RTFM answers
could be avoided if the documentation and list archives were easier to use,
more up to date and less fragmented. I still find searching for answers in
the IC docs/archives/etc is often quite frustrating.

Jamie Neil